why are hyundai motors so weak
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Joined
·
3,276 Posts
:ermm: "weak" is definitely not the word. Maybe they have low power output b/c they are 4 cylinder engines? My accent has 115,000 miles on it and im pumping 11psi of boost through it everyday and it still runs strong. I've beat on it since I've got it.... Boosted for 6months on stock internals/head gasket and all. I'd say thats one hell of a motor!
Joined
·
4,351 Posts
let me ask this...
Why do all Honda's values have a death tick?
Cause they are engineered to their limits, and they may make more power, but they have issues with that. My Beta engine is dead silent, with 145,000 miles. My buddies Civic, with just a tick under 70k is dying... his motor makes more noise than my '74 truck...:dead:
Low power=long life.
:
Id rather have my car run forever than go baddass for a week.
Why do all Honda's values have a death tick?
Cause they are engineered to their limits, and they may make more power, but they have issues with that. My Beta engine is dead silent, with 145,000 miles. My buddies Civic, with just a tick under 70k is dying... his motor makes more noise than my '74 truck...:dead:
Low power=long life.
:Id rather have my car run forever than go baddass for a week.
Man o man your buddy must be screwing around a bit to much with the engine, my old '92 Civic made it to 290,000ks with only oil changes and other regular maintenance other than that the engine was solid, I only got rid of the Civic because it was rusting away to nothing. But saying I couldn't be happeier with my 2002 GSi Accent with the 1.6 is also still running strong after 114,000k's on it and it looks like it should be able to make it to 200,000k's without any problems.Originally posted by wilburisthecoolest
[body]
let me ask this...
Why do all Honda's values have a death tick?
Cause they are engineered to their limits, and they may make more power, but they have issues with that. My Beta engine is dead silent, with 145,000 miles. My buddies Civic, with just a tick under 70k is dying... his motor makes more noise than my '74 truck...:dead:
Low power=long life.
Id rather have my car run forever than go baddass for a week.
[/body]
Laterz
Hyundai cars/engines are engineered to a price point. Being on the bottom end of the cost spectrum means their engines are NOT going to put out as much power as engine's in more expensive cars. Why? power and efficency cost MONEY. R&D money. Money Hyundai isn't spending because they don't have to. The AVERAGE Hyundai buyer wants a car with resonable power to get out of it's own way, and they want it CHEAP.
Until Hyundai re-positions itself as a brand, you won't see any High HP motors (compared to displacement, and competitor's offerings). They don't need to spend the $$$, so they don't. Let's face it, while us enthusiast would love a 125 HP per Liter Hyundai motor, the average buying public doesn't. The AVERAGE Hyundai buying pubic just wants enough power to motor down the freeway at semi-legal speeds.
BTW, you could make the same comment about fuel efficency. Hyundai motors are very inneficent compared to makes/models offered by other companies. Why? Hyundai buyers don't want to pay extra for that extra 5mpg.
Until Hyundai re-positions itself as a brand, you won't see any High HP motors (compared to displacement, and competitor's offerings). They don't need to spend the $$$, so they don't. Let's face it, while us enthusiast would love a 125 HP per Liter Hyundai motor, the average buying public doesn't. The AVERAGE Hyundai buying pubic just wants enough power to motor down the freeway at semi-legal speeds.
BTW, you could make the same comment about fuel efficency. Hyundai motors are very inneficent compared to makes/models offered by other companies. Why? Hyundai buyers don't want to pay extra for that extra 5mpg.
Joined
·
7,256 Posts
There's a saying that's pretty old; you can choose any combination of the following, but not all three:
-Power
-reliability
-cost effectiveness.
It also applies to production lines I'm afraid; you're not going to score a GTR for the same price as an Accent; the GTR will never be as reliable as the accent if you manage to get one within the same price range[I've seen guys get their Skylines for cheap and then have to spend half what the car was worth just to get it reliable, and then spend double what the car was worth to have it both quick and reliable] Random's hit it right on the head m8, if you want it quick, youre going to need to spend a bomb, or get a Westfield. :lol:
Joined
·
4,351 Posts
Yeah, the old saying...
Speed=Money
Speed=Money
i reckon these motors are bullet-proof. not weak
my mother had an X3 that she drove over 200 000kms.
the car rusted and fell apart around the motor.
fast? no. if you want fast N/A, get an engineered performance car.
weak? definetly not. treated right, these will last a very long time.
my mother had an X3 that she drove over 200 000kms.
the car rusted and fell apart around the motor.
fast? no. if you want fast N/A, get an engineered performance car.
weak? definetly not. treated right, these will last a very long time.
Joined
·
4,351 Posts
Yeah, i've found the less power you make, the better the engine really. Bulletproof is right. Like the Ford 5.0, it always made less power than its Chevy counterpart, but they seemed to take more of a beating. This can go either way i guess... and Dodge, their 318's and sixs will run forever. I know of at least 10 Dodges from 61-65 that are still running today, just fine, without any rebuilds. It all comes down to the design. Lots of hondas tick, thats cause they were designed on the edge. The Beta has room to spare so to speak. Just like the 4g63. They were just very well engineered.
And every 1.5, 1.6, 1.8 honda i have seen/heard ticks... Even my grandmas B18 Integra. It only has 45,000 miles on it, and is serviced very regurally.
And every 1.5, 1.6, 1.8 honda i have seen/heard ticks... Even my grandmas B18 Integra. It only has 45,000 miles on it, and is serviced very regurally.
Well hondas are cheap here, make nice power compared to others and they run forever and they don't like to eat gas not much..
How you can say Honda civic type-r would take lot of money when it is here the cheapest hot hatch you can buy and sure the fastest one? Can you say the K20 isn't long life engine when tuners are squeezing out 300whp numbers of it in NA form? And they're spinning it to 10 000 rpm..
You're theory just don't work here but that's okay, you don't need to defend your car to let's say honda people. Let it just be.
Here in Finland has several 400 000 km nissan sunnys, Honda civics and Corollas doing well and these cars are made in '80.. so why bother saying Hyundai motors are long lasting? That's pretty old news, like 20 years old already to have a cars engine that lasts long.
[Edited by eyelid on Feb 12, 2006 3:51 AM]
How you can say Honda civic type-r would take lot of money when it is here the cheapest hot hatch you can buy and sure the fastest one? Can you say the K20 isn't long life engine when tuners are squeezing out 300whp numbers of it in NA form? And they're spinning it to 10 000 rpm..
You're theory just don't work here but that's okay, you don't need to defend your car to let's say honda people. Let it just be.
Here in Finland has several 400 000 km nissan sunnys, Honda civics and Corollas doing well and these cars are made in '80.. so why bother saying Hyundai motors are long lasting? That's pretty old news, like 20 years old already to have a cars engine that lasts long.
[Edited by eyelid on Feb 12, 2006 3:51 AM]
Joined
·
6,330 Posts
Originally posted by wilburisthecoolest
[body]
let me ask this...
Why do all Honda's values have a death tick?
Cause they are engineered to their limits, and they may make more power, but they have issues with that. My Beta engine is dead silent, with 145,000 miles. My buddies Civic, with just a tick under 70k is dying... his motor makes more noise than my '74 truck...:dead:
Low power=long life.
Id rather have my car run forever than go baddass for a week.
[/body]
you can say that again....
Joined
·
4,351 Posts
Finally someone believes me...Originally posted by TAK82
[body]
Originally posted by wilburisthecoolest
[body]
let me ask this...
Why do all Honda's values have a death tick?
Cause they are engineered to their limits, and they may make more power, but they have issues with that. My Beta engine is dead silent, with 145,000 miles. My buddies Civic, with just a tick under 70k is dying... his motor makes more noise than my '74 truck...:dead:
Low power=long life.
Id rather have my car run forever than go baddass for a week.
[/body]
you can say that again....
[/body]
:
Joined
·
1,651 Posts
We got your back Wilbur. Crooked (H) for life. My moms got an 02 Sonata 4cyl with the shiftronic auto trans and the things got like 75,000 and starts and runs the same as the day we bought it. 75,000 miles later and still does 95+ on the freeway. But if we are gonna compare motors I gotta bring up an oldy but goody. Im bringin it old school, Toyota 22R. My first car was an 88' Toyota pickup had a carburated 22R in it with a 4 speed stick. Had 280,000 miles on it and the oil was still clean everytime i changed it. hat motor is a beast itll damn near run forever. Hell I totaled that truck and the motor still ran.
My motto is: You may get there faster.......but ill get there cheaper!
[Edited by atrimble_2001 on Feb 13, 2006 12:33 AM]
[Edited by atrimble_2001 on Feb 13, 2006 12:33 AM]
My motto is: You may get there faster.......but ill get there cheaper!
[Edited by atrimble_2001 on Feb 13, 2006 12:33 AM]
[Edited by atrimble_2001 on Feb 13, 2006 12:33 AM]
There are three factors here.
The first is that compared to the competition Hyundai's power output is competitive. The Beta is competitive at 138hp with the:
Ford Focus SE (136hp)
Honda Civic (140hp)
Nissan Sentra (126hp)
Toyota Corolla CE (126hp)
Mitsubishi Lancer ES (120hp)
Volkswagen Golf GL (115hp)
The Alpha's 110hp is competitive with:
Scion xA and xB (103hp)
Toyota Echo (108hp)
Toyota Yaris (106hp)
Honda Fit (109hp)
Even close to the Golf GL's 115hp
The problem comes from comparing Hyundai's offerings to non competing products. We would all like to see Hyundai compete directly with the Civic SI, but at this time there is no competetor from Hyundai so you're comparing apples and oranges.
Second point is that even though Hyundai's engines are currently competitive the introduction of the Theta and Lambda engines will further raise the Hyundai Performance bar to the point of competing directly with the hotter versions of some of the cars mentioned above and many other cars that are currently not direct competitors with Hyundai. The Theta is slated to have a 300hp turbocharged variant in the upcoming Dodge Caliber SRT-4, and there is a rumored 400+hp version of the EVO also sporting a Theta. With this potent engine in Hyundai's arsenal it would be surprising if we don't see a turbocharged variant producing at least 200hp find it's way into the Elantra, and maybe even into an Accent similar to the Accent SR. The next Tiburon is going to be rwd and possibly awd and powered by the 3.8l Lambda producing over 250hp naturally aspirated. With these two engines being introduced into Hyundai's product line there will no longer be any reason to clain Hyundais are underpowered.
Last point is that Hyundai's Alpha, Beta, Delta, Sigma, and Sirius engines are not weak, they are simply detuned to add reliability without requiring extensive overengineering or pushing the 100,000 mile warranty out of a reasonable price range company wide. They do utilize fairly dated engine technology, and are slowly going to all be replaced with stronger, more powerful, more efficient versions like the Theta and Lambda. Detuning is a common practice in the auto industry, a good example is the 5.0l found in my Bronco. It is rated at 185 horsepower, while the 5.0l in a Mustang the same year is rated at 225hp, 40hp more. You can expect a longer service life out of the Bronco's engine as a direct result of the lower power output. Many military vehicles have even more drastic detuning, like the Unimog S404, equipped with a Mercedes-Benz 2.2l and 2.8l I-6's rated at between 80hp and 110hp while the versions in Mercedes cars were outputting up to more than 180hp. MB did this because in exchange for the lower power output the Unimogs' engines were now virtually indestructable. It was nearly impossible to blow one up because when working at full load the engine only saw stresses comparable to light acceleration stresses in the automobile versions of the engines.
Well, those are my $0.02
The first is that compared to the competition Hyundai's power output is competitive. The Beta is competitive at 138hp with the:
Ford Focus SE (136hp)
Honda Civic (140hp)
Nissan Sentra (126hp)
Toyota Corolla CE (126hp)
Mitsubishi Lancer ES (120hp)
Volkswagen Golf GL (115hp)
The Alpha's 110hp is competitive with:
Scion xA and xB (103hp)
Toyota Echo (108hp)
Toyota Yaris (106hp)
Honda Fit (109hp)
Even close to the Golf GL's 115hp
The problem comes from comparing Hyundai's offerings to non competing products. We would all like to see Hyundai compete directly with the Civic SI, but at this time there is no competetor from Hyundai so you're comparing apples and oranges.
Second point is that even though Hyundai's engines are currently competitive the introduction of the Theta and Lambda engines will further raise the Hyundai Performance bar to the point of competing directly with the hotter versions of some of the cars mentioned above and many other cars that are currently not direct competitors with Hyundai. The Theta is slated to have a 300hp turbocharged variant in the upcoming Dodge Caliber SRT-4, and there is a rumored 400+hp version of the EVO also sporting a Theta. With this potent engine in Hyundai's arsenal it would be surprising if we don't see a turbocharged variant producing at least 200hp find it's way into the Elantra, and maybe even into an Accent similar to the Accent SR. The next Tiburon is going to be rwd and possibly awd and powered by the 3.8l Lambda producing over 250hp naturally aspirated. With these two engines being introduced into Hyundai's product line there will no longer be any reason to clain Hyundais are underpowered.
Last point is that Hyundai's Alpha, Beta, Delta, Sigma, and Sirius engines are not weak, they are simply detuned to add reliability without requiring extensive overengineering or pushing the 100,000 mile warranty out of a reasonable price range company wide. They do utilize fairly dated engine technology, and are slowly going to all be replaced with stronger, more powerful, more efficient versions like the Theta and Lambda. Detuning is a common practice in the auto industry, a good example is the 5.0l found in my Bronco. It is rated at 185 horsepower, while the 5.0l in a Mustang the same year is rated at 225hp, 40hp more. You can expect a longer service life out of the Bronco's engine as a direct result of the lower power output. Many military vehicles have even more drastic detuning, like the Unimog S404, equipped with a Mercedes-Benz 2.2l and 2.8l I-6's rated at between 80hp and 110hp while the versions in Mercedes cars were outputting up to more than 180hp. MB did this because in exchange for the lower power output the Unimogs' engines were now virtually indestructable. It was nearly impossible to blow one up because when working at full load the engine only saw stresses comparable to light acceleration stresses in the automobile versions of the engines.
Well, those are my $0.02
Joined
·
4,351 Posts
You saw the Top Gear vid on those Toyotas right? Dam i want one bad... But yeah, kimchee power foreva!
:1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Join the discussion
Join now to ask and comment!